Leinster A thread 2012-13

[Donny B.]

With the B&I game against Leeds coming up in just over a fortnight (same day as Exeter home match), is there any warm-ups games coming up for the A's against the other provinces?

I know that Ulster, Connacht and Munster have been playing each other a bit and I'm a little surprised we've been so quiet, although injuries and the amount of academy players on under-20 duty may have contributed to that.

[tones]

With the B&I game against Leeds coming up in just over a fortnight (same day as Exeter home match), is there any warm-ups games coming up for the A's against the other provinces?

I know that Ulster, Connacht and Munster have been playing each other a bit and I'm a little surprised we've been so quiet, although injuries and the amount of academy players on under-20 duty may have contributed to that.

Think the senior team has used 40 odd players so far so would imagine that has contributed as well.

[cormac]

With the B&I game against Leeds coming up in just over a fortnight (same day as Exeter home match), is there any warm-ups games coming up for the A's against the other provinces?

I know that Ulster, Connacht and Munster have been playing each other a bit and I'm a little surprised we've been so quiet, although injuries and the amount of academy players on under-20 duty may have contributed to that.

Seems highly unlikely as the Ulster Bank League starts up this weekend, so looks like it'll be straight into the B&I Cup without a warm-up. Going to be an interesting selection for the first couple of games given the injury situation and Goodman and Bent not arriving until November.

Props; McGrath and O'Connell on the loosehead is very strong, Moore and Furlong the options on the tight-head.
Hooker: Tom Sexton to start. David Doyle was mentioned as being injured so that would just leave us with Brian Byrne or drafting in a club player.
Locks: Will depend on who makes the HEC side but two of Browne/Denton/Roux should be available. If Flanagan is still injured, then possibly Tadhg Beirne on the bench or possibly Neilus Keogh again.
Back-row: Very stretched here. Depends on whether the likes of Murphy or Marshall make the HEC squad. Is Gilsenan back training yet? Could see some of the Year One academy back-rows getting drafted in.
Scrum-half: McGrath to start, AN Other Club Player to be drafted in to sit on the bench.
Fly-half: Reid or Marsh to start depending on who's available to play in the centre.
Centres: O'Shea will presumably be involved but his partner will depend on whether Macken is needed for the senior squad.
Back 3: Depends on whether Conway or Carr or both are made available. Hudson, Boyle and Coghlan-Murray could also feature.

[cormac]

BIC starts next week with the home game v Leeds. Could be an interesting line-up considering the injuries to the first-team squad.

Forwards:
1 Jack McGrath (assuming Healy is fit, otherwise Jack O'Connell)
2 Tom Sexton
3 Martin Moore
4 Tom Denton
5 Tadhg Beirne
6 Ben Marshall
7 Jordan Coghlan
8 Jack Conan or Leo Auva'a (depends on McLaughlin's fitness)

Subs: Brian Byrne, Jack O'Connell (James Tracy), Tadhg Furlong, Gavin Thornbury, Gilsenan (if fit, otherwise vd Flier or Leavy).

Backs:

9 Luke McGrath
10 Cathal Marsh
11 Andrew Boyle
12 Noel Reid
13 Colm O'Shea
14 Darren Hudson
15 Mike Sherlock/Sam Coghlan-Murray

Bench: Bring yer boots

[johng]

BIC starts next week with the home game v Leeds. Could be an interesting line-up considering the injuries to the first-team squad.

Forwards:
1 Jack McGrath (assuming Healy is fit, otherwise Jack O'Connell)
2 Tom Sexton
3 Martin Moore
4 Tom Denton
5 Tadhg Beirne
6 Ben Marshall
7 Jordan Coghlan
8 Jack Conan or Leo Auva'a (depends on McLaughlin's fitness)

Subs: Brian Byrne, Jack O'Connell (James Tracy), Tadhg Furlong, Gavin Thornbury, Gilsenan (if fit, otherwise vd Flier or Leavy).

Backs:

9 Luke McGrath
10 Cathal Marsh
11 Andrew Boyle
12 Noel Reid
13 Colm O'Shea
14 Darren Hudson
15 Mike Sherlock/Sam Coghlan-Murray

Bench: Bring yer boots

Opportunity for someone here.
Is Hudson not injured too though?

[hugonaut]

Macken's not in the HEC squad, so I'd expect him to start at No13. Personally speaking, I'd be far more interested in playing Jordan Coghlan at No12 ahead of Noel Reid. We've three opensides in the Academy [Gilsenan, van der Flier and Leavy] so we should look at picking one of them.

I think Reid's future is as a 12/10 [or maybe a 12/10/15] rather than an out-and-out No12, so while there are obviously issues with some of his decision-making at outhalf, he should still be working at it. Maybe it's a bit of a harsh criticism of a still-young player, but I don't think he's quite good enough to be a professional one position player – not many are.

We've brought in guys like Shaun Berne, Mat Berquist and [this season] Andrew Goodman to do the 10/12 job, and while you can't ignore the difference in experience that those lads have in comparison with Reid, it has been a very questionable use of a NIQ slot in the last two seasons. Over that period, those two players played a combined total of 300 minutes. Granted, they both would have played more were it not for serious injury, but we more than survived without their input – we won two European cups and competed for two league finals.

Essentially, I'd like to see Reid being pushed to fill that role on a longer-term basis. We've got Sexton and Madigan at No10, so at best Reid is going to be third choice outhalf for the next two seasons – there's no huge pressure on him to step up immediately. I'm not particularly excited about seeing Noel Reid play No12; I'm far more interested in seeing us do without journeymen imports like Berne, Berquist and Goodman.

The B&I Cup is exactly the level where the Coghlan experiment can be carried out – obviously we should try and win the thing, but the long-term view is far more relevant. A Coghlan [19]/Macken [21] partnership has great size, good speed in Macken and youth. Coghlan seems tough and clever, and obviously is very physical given that he has played most of his rugby in the backrow.

[jezzer]

Macken's not in the HEC squad, so I'd expect him to start at No13. Personally speaking, I'd be far more interested in playing Jordan Coghlan at No12 ahead of Noel Reid. We've three opensides in the Academy [Gilsenan, van der Flier and Leavy] so we should look at picking one of them.

I think Reid's future is as a 12/10 [or maybe a 12/10/15] rather than an out-and-out No12, so while there are obviously issues with some of his decision-making at outhalf, he should still be working at it. Maybe it's a bit of a harsh criticism of a still-young player, but I don't think he's quite good enough to be a professional one position player – not many are.

We've brought in guys like Shaun Berne, Mat Berquist and [this season] Andrew Goodman to do the 10/12 job, and while you can't ignore the difference in experience that those lads have in comparison with Reid, it has been a very questionable use of a NIQ slot in the last two seasons. Over that period, those two players played a combined total of 300 minutes. Granted, they both would have played more were it not for serious injury, but we more than survived without their input – we won two European cups and competed for two league finals.

Essentially, I'd like to see Reid being pushed to fill that role on a longer-term basis. We've got Sexton and Madigan at No10, so at best Reid is going to be third choice outhalf for the next two seasons – there's no huge pressure on him to step up immediately. I'm not particularly excited about seeing Noel Reid play No12; I'm far more interested in seeing us do without journeymen imports like Berne, Berquist and Goodman.

The B&I Cup is exactly the level where the Coghlan experiment can be carried out – obviously we should try and win the thing, but the long-term view is far more relevant. A Coghlan [19]/Macken [21] partnership has great size, good speed in Macken and youth. Coghlan seems tough and clever, and obviously is very physical given that he has played most of his rugby in the backrow.

Fully agree with all of this. Dan Leavy is going to be a special player. I'd like to see him fast tracked.

[ronk]

Macken's not in the HEC squad, so I'd expect him to start at No13. Personally speaking, I'd be far more interested in playing Jordan Coghlan at No12 ahead of Noel Reid. We've three opensides in the Academy [Gilsenan, van der Flier and Leavy] so we should look at picking one of them.

I think Reid's future is as a 12/10 [or maybe a 12/10/15] rather than an out-and-out No12, so while there are obviously issues with some of his decision-making at outhalf, he should still be working at it. Maybe it's a bit of a harsh criticism of a still-young player, but I don't think he's quite good enough to be a professional one position player – not many are.

We've brought in guys like Shaun Berne, Mat Berquist and [this season] Andrew Goodman to do the 10/12 job, and while you can't ignore the difference in experience that those lads have in comparison with Reid, it has been a very questionable use of a NIQ slot in the last two seasons. Over that period, those two players played a combined total of 300 minutes. Granted, they both would have played more were it not for serious injury, but we more than survived without their input – we won two European cups and competed for two league finals.

Essentially, I'd like to see Reid being pushed to fill that role on a longer-term basis. We've got Sexton and Madigan at No10, so at best Reid is going to be third choice outhalf for the next two seasons – there's no huge pressure on him to step up immediately. I'm not particularly excited about seeing Noel Reid play No12; I'm far more interested in seeing us do without journeymen imports like Berne, Berquist and Goodman.

The B&I Cup is exactly the level where the Coghlan experiment can be carried out – obviously we should try and win the thing, but the long-term view is far more relevant. A Coghlan [19]/Macken [21] partnership has great size, good speed in Macken and youth. Coghlan seems tough and clever, and obviously is very physical given that he has played most of his rugby in the backrow.

I thought Gilsenan was still out for a while. van der Flier and Leavy are both very young, might not be ready for immediate action, even at A level.

Obviously Coghlan is worth watching to see how that's going, but it's still a risk. Reid is coming on, I thought his defence has shown signs of improvement, and Munster would be the type of team that woud target him if they were getting milage. Bearing in mind that he's still an academy player and he's come through without any special pedigree, I reckon he's largely doing alright. There are some things he does well.

2009-2010 showed how good a use of an NIQ spot (which might well have been vacant anyway) Berne was. Serious injuries are like that, but it's worth thinking about how useful they would have been if they hadn't been the ones getting those injuries.

[Donny B.]

The Leinster 'A' team to face Leeds Carnegie in Saturday evening's opening round of the British & Irish Cup campaign at Donnybrook (KO: 7pm) has been named...

Jack McGrath leads a young looking side which includes 14 Academy graduates in the starting line-up for the visit of the Yorkshire side. John Cooney links up with Noel Reid at half back, with Collie O’Shea partnering Brendan Macken at centre.
In the pack, McGrath starts in the front row alongside hooker Thomas Sexton and Jack O’Connell, with ex Leeds second row Tom Denton locking down alongside Ben Marshall.

*There will be free entry for Leinster Season Ticket Holders for all British & Irish Cup pool games upon presentation of this year’s membership card.

LEINSTER 'A':

15: Darren Hudson
14: Andrew Boyle
13: Brendan Macken
12: Collie O’Shea
11: Sam Coghlan Murray
10: Noel Reid
9: John Cooney

1: Jack O’Connell
2: Thomas Sexton
3: Jack McGrath CAPTAIN
4: Tom Denton
5: Ben Marshall
6: Jordan Coghlan
7: Josh van der Flier
8: Jack Conan

REPLACEMENTS:

16: James Tracy
17: Tadhg Furlong
18: Tadhg Beirne
19: Dan Leavy
20: Dave Shanahan
21: Cathal Marsh
22: Tom Daly

[ronk]

I'm not seeing a 2nd hooker in the squad, someone must be able to double up, but I don't know who.

[Donny B.]

I'm not seeing a 2nd hooker in the squad, someone must be able to double up, but I don't know who.

Tracy. Remember reading that he's been practicising his throwing to act as an emergency hooker.

[cormac]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

[Donny B.]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

Well noticed. Yeah, two more for the injury list, cause Moore definitely would have started. I presume Leeds have a decent enough scrum and it will be a big test for McGrath on the tight-side. Furlong may well be asked to step in if things are going badly.

[johng]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

Well noticed. Yeah, two more for the injury list, cause Moore definitely would have started. I presume Leeds have a decent enough scrum and it will be a big test for McGrath on the tight-side. Furlong may well be asked to step in if things are going badly.

Didn't we get Denton from Leeds? Bit of crack for him then, if so.

[bamboozle]

BIC starts next week with the home game v Leeds. Could be an interesting line-up considering the injuries to the first-team squad.

Forwards:
1 Jack McGrath (assuming Healy is fit, otherwise Jack O'Connell)
2 Tom Sexton
3 Martin Moore
4 Tom Denton
5 Tadhg Beirne
6 Ben Marshall
7 Jordan Coghlan
8 Jack Conan or Leo Auva'a (depends on McLaughlin's fitness)

Subs: Brian Byrne, Jack O'Connell (James Tracy), Tadhg Furlong, Gavin Thornbury, Gilsenan (if fit, otherwise vd Flier or Leavy).

Backs:

9 Luke McGrath
10 Cathal Marsh
11 Andrew Boyle
12 Noel Reid
13 Colm O'Shea
14 Darren Hudson
15 Mike Sherlock/Sam Coghlan-Murray

Bench: Bring yer boots

Sherlock quit the Academy.

Anyone got any news on Flanagan's injury? not a peep about it anywhere

[cormac]

[
Sherlock quit the Academy.

Anyone got any news on Flanagan's injury? not a peep about it anywhere

What's the story with Sherlock? Other priorities?

[hugonaut]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

Delighted to see big Tom Daly called up - he was No12 and goalkicker for the U20s this year, and is a big, rawboned dude. We really lack size in our three-quarterline at the moment, and I'd be very interested to see how Daly does outside Reid and inside Macken for a 20 minute spell. Nothing against Collie O'Shea at all [a very tidy player in his own right] but just keen to see how Daly goes, if he's got a bit of pace, if he's got good handling under pressure.

Some photos from the U20 interpro against Connacht serve to show how big he is:

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/686435/

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/686183/ [in the centre of the lineup with head taped up and dark hair - No8 Peadar Timmins is to his left and second row Jerry Sexton is two down on his right]

[Donny B.]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

Well noticed. Yeah, two more for the injury list, cause Moore definitely would have started. I presume Leeds have a decent enough scrum and it will be a big test for McGrath on the tight-side. Furlong may well be asked to step in if things are going badly.

Didn't we get Denton from Leeds? Bit of crack for him then, if so.

We did indeed.

[cormac]

Average age of that 22 is under 21. Tom Denton is the elder statesman at 24.

[dropkick]

I'm assuming that Martin Moore and Luke McGrath have joined the injury list. Shanahan and Daly were in the U-20 side this season.

Delighted to see big Tom Daly called up - he was No12 and goalkicker for the U20s this year, and is a big, rawboned dude. We really lack size in our three-quarterline at the moment, and I'd be very interested to see how Daly does outside Reid and inside Macken for a 20 minute spell. Nothing against Collie O'Shea at all [a very tidy player in his own right] but just keen to see how Daly goes, if he's got a bit of pace, if he's got good handling under pressure.

Some photos from the U20 interpro against Connacht serve to show how big he is:

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/686435/

http://www.sportsfile.com/id/686183/ [in the centre of the lineup with head taped up and dark hair - No8 Peadar Timmins is to his left and second row Jerry Sexton is two down on his right]

It should be interesting to see how Daly gets on in the next season or two. Do you think he'll make the Irish U20s? If he is a good kicker then its likely he has decent handling ability too.