Leinster Squad 19-20

[Oldschoolsocks]

It is exactly what you said. Leinster won the HC Cup and immediately lost key players due to jealous other provinces. Then they lost their 1st HC final out of 5.

The decision to balance the provinces wasn’t free and the form of the Irish team dropped rapidly in 2019 too.

Munster bombed so badly they went out in the group stages and had to sign 2 RWC winning stars as they rebuild again again.

After winning the European Cup in 2018 Leinster lost 2 players to other provinces.

Jordi went to Ulster because he wanted more playing time and also wanted to play for Ireland so Ulster was a good fit.
That summer Leinster promoted in no particular order Doris, Murphy, and Connor. So I don't think him leaving was the reason we lost to Sarries.

Carbery went to Munster because Ireland didn't have a backup 10 playing regularly and either him or Byrne were the closest thing to a backup 10 for Ireland at the time so we needed at least one of them to be playing regularly in Ireland.
Leinster were using Carbery as a 15 so got Tomane as a replacement.

As much as it pains me to see part of our production line siphoned off every year at the end of the day we can't keep all the quality we're producing happy so it's not some anti leinster conspiracy.

it's not a conspiracy against Leinster, it's a wilful looting of the treasure trove by feckless neighbours

[ronk]

It cost Leinster a lot when trying to compete with the likes of Saracens.

The systems needs teams at the pinnacle of European rugby, it does not need the provinces to be even. Did Leinster win in 2009 because they took a load of Munster’s best players. It was unthinkable nonsense back then.

The IRFU knew they were damaging Leinster’s chances of winning the HC.

[riocard911]

It cost Leinster a lot when trying to compete with the likes of Saracens.

The systems needs teams at the pinnacle of European rugby, it does not need the provinces to be even. Did Leinster win in 2009 because they took a load of Munster’s best players. It was unthinkable nonsense back then.

The IRFU knew they were damaging Leinster’s chances of winning the HC.

+1!!!

[Workhorse]

it's not a conspiracy against Leinster, it's a wilful looting of the treasure trove by feckless neighbours

It cost Leinster a lot when trying to compete with the likes of Saracens.

The systems needs teams at the pinnacle of European rugby, it does not need the provinces to be even. Did Leinster win in 2009 because they took a load of Munster’s best players. It was unthinkable nonsense back then.

The IRFU knew they were damaging Leinster’s chances of winning the HC.

I suppose Leinster should just win the lottery on a regular basis and play 3 games a week? Because that's the only way Leinster would get anyway close to being in a position to keep all the talent we produce happy.

[munster#1]

it's not a conspiracy against Leinster, it's a wilful looting of the treasure trove by feckless neighbours

It cost Leinster a lot when trying to compete with the likes of Saracens.

The systems needs teams at the pinnacle of European rugby, it does not need the provinces to be even. Did Leinster win in 2009 because they took a load of Munster’s best players. It was unthinkable nonsense back then.

The IRFU knew they were damaging Leinster’s chances of winning the HC.

I suppose Leinster should just win the lottery on a regular basis and play 3 games a week? Because that's the only way Leinster would get anyway close to being in a position to keep all the talent we produce happy.

Leinster have been fortunate to date to lose only squad players.
Many of them appear to have instigated the moves themselves.

Losing the likes of McGrath, Jordi and Carbery being the biggest loses, but at the time of their moves, none of them were guaranteed to start big games.
All fit, Carberry probably wouldn’t make the bench.

Leinster have also made similar signings, even in the early days, taking the likes of Keogh, Fogarty, hogan, Boss, and more recently 2 of Connachts first choice players in Cronin and Henshaw, and even tried unsuccessfully to sign Casey.

You can’t complain if other provinces sign your players if you have done then same.

[wixfjord]

There's an utter neuroticism and victim complex in some of the last few pages that's reminiscent of Munsterfans at its worst lads.

Booo Munster.
Booo IRFU.
Booo Nucifora.

We should get to keep all our players and anything else is a scandal.

[ronk]

I suppose Leinster should just win the lottery on a regular basis and play 3 games a week? Because that's the only way Leinster would get anyway close to being in a position to keep all the talent we produce happy.

Carbery was mid-contract and was happy until he was told that staying at Leinster was damaging his Ireland chances, by the guy who picks him.
1111
He was under huge pressure and he went on record about it at the time.

What you are saying is that the IRFU did Leinster a favour to avoid the break up of an overstocked squad. Carbery went to a team with more outhalves.

This is humbug. And thats before even mentioning that Schmidt actually tried to move him first to Ulster as an emergency replacement. Munster were out for themselves only.

[Oldschoolsocks]

it's not a conspiracy against Leinster, it's a wilful looting of the treasure trove by feckless neighbours

It cost Leinster a lot when trying to compete with the likes of Saracens.

The systems needs teams at the pinnacle of European rugby, it does not need the provinces to be even. Did Leinster win in 2009 because they took a load of Munster’s best players. It was unthinkable nonsense back then.

The IRFU knew they were damaging Leinster’s chances of winning the HC.

I suppose Leinster should just win the lottery on a regular basis and play 3 games a week? Because that's the only way Leinster would get anyway close to being in a position to keep all the talent we produce happy.

Leinster have been fortunate to date to lose only squad players.
Many of them appear to have instigated the moves themselves.

Losing the likes of McGrath, Jordi and Carbery being the biggest loses, but at the time of their moves, none of them were guaranteed to start big games.
All fit, Carberry probably wouldn’t make the bench.

Leinster have also made similar signings, even in the early days, taking the likes of Keogh, Fogarty, hogan, Boss, and more recently 2 of Connachts first choice players in Cronin and Henshaw, and even tried unsuccessfully to sign Casey.

You can’t complain if other provinces sign your players if you have done then same.

make sure you're nice and warmed up there m#1, a stretch like that could easily pull a hammy

[Workhorse]

Carbery was mid-contract and was happy until he was told that staying at Leinster was damaging his Ireland chances, by the guy who picks him.
1111
He was under huge pressure and he went on record about it at the time.

What you are saying is that the IRFU did Leinster a favour to avoid the break up of an overstocked squad. Carbery went to a team with more outhalves.

This is humbug. And thats before even mentioning that Schmidt actually tried to move him first to Ulster as an emergency replacement. Munster were out for themselves only.

Carbery wanted and still wants to play for Ireland. Leinster had Irelands first choice out half and full back. So Irelands options were to either go to the World Cup with a backup outhalf that doesn't start the big games for his club unless there's an injury and when he does play for his club there's a good chance its not in the 10 jersey, or go with someone else, or encourage him to move clubs.

Carbery knew this and moved club. Like it or not for Carbery and Ireland it makes perfect sense and leinster had and still have Ross Byrne at 10 and Larmour at 15. The move made sense for everyone.

[Oldschoolsocks]

Carbery was mid-contract and was happy until he was told that staying at Leinster was damaging his Ireland chances, by the guy who picks him.
1111
He was under huge pressure and he went on record about it at the time.

What you are saying is that the IRFU did Leinster a favour to avoid the break up of an overstocked squad. Carbery went to a team with more outhalves.

This is humbug. And thats before even mentioning that Schmidt actually tried to move him first to Ulster as an emergency replacement. Munster were out for themselves only.

Carbery wanted and still wants to play for Ireland. Leinster had Irelands first choice out half and full back. So Irelands options were to either go to the World Cup with a backup outhalf that doesn't start the big games for his club unless there's an injury and when he does play for his club there's a good chance its not in the 10 jersey, or go with someone else, or encourage him to move clubs.

Carbery knew this and moved club. Like it or not for Carbery and Ireland it makes perfect sense and leinster had and still have Ross Byrne at 10 and Larmour at 15. The move made sense for everyone.

you can try to rewrite the history all you like there Horse but the move from Leinster to wherever was not initiated by JC, it was engineered by Schmidt and Lucifura, and has actually not worked out to well for him to date.

all that said, it's done now and I wish the lad well.

[Workhorse]

you can try to rewrite the history all you like there Horse, but the move from Leinster to wherever was not initiated by JC, it was engineered by Schmidt and Lucifura, and has actually not worked out to well for him to date.

all that said, it's done now and I wish the lad well.

Where have I even come close to attempting to rewrite history.

A player was told by his national team coach he needed to be first choice at his club to go to the world cup. Ireland have a rule you must be playing in Ireland to play for Ireland too. Carbery knew this and no matter how the opportunity came to move its not as if it was against his will. If you think any of that's rewriting history then God help you. It has happened all over the world in all sports and it will continue to happen because that's how sports works.

[Oldschoolsocks]

you can try to rewrite the history all you like there Horse, but the move from Leinster to wherever was not initiated by JC, it was engineered by Schmidt and Lucifura, and has actually not worked out to well for him to date.

all that said, it's done now and I wish the lad well.

Where have I even come close to attempting to rewrite history.

A player was told by his national team coach he needed to be first choice at his club to go to the world cup. Ireland have a rule you must be playing in Ireland to play for Ireland too. Carbery knew this and no matter how the opportunity came to move its not as if it was against his will. If you think any of that's rewriting history then God help you. It has happened all over the world in all sports and it will continue to happen because that's how sports works.

easy tiger, you're slanting this as it being JC's idea, and the record shows that it was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifura.

That is attempting to rewrite history. Simples...

[Workhorse]

easy tiger, you're slanting this as it being JC's idea, and the record shows that it was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifura.

That is attempting to rewrite history. Simples...

I never even went close to slanting it as his choice. I just outlined why it was done and why it made sense for Carbery to move. He wasn't forced into it it just made sense for him.

[heno]

2 points:

The whole carberry thing was preempted by the Jackson affair. If Jackson was still in place and maintaining form for ulster, he would have been js choice for the world Cup (likely we would have been campaigning to bring carberry).

We lost the the euro final to a team that was cheating to maintain its lofty position. That's a pretty high bar to have been dragged down to by our squad "decimation".

Sent from my SM-A520F using Tapatalk

[Oldschoolsocks]

easy tiger, you're slanting this as it being JC's idea, and the record shows that it was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifura.

That is attempting to rewrite history. Simples...

I never even went close to slanting it as his choice. I just outlined why it was done and why it made sense for Carbery to move. He wasn't forced into it it just made sense for him.

perfect, we're in agreement that this move was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifora so.

[Workhorse]

perfect, we're in agreement that this move was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifora so.

Nope telling a player they need to be first choice is not the same as engineering a move. And even if it was engineered, the IRFU and the national team head coach organising a move so an international player is playing regular rugby instead of sitting on the bench my God what a crime against humanity

[Oldschoolsocks]

perfect, we're in agreement that this move was engineered by Joe Schmidt and Lucifora so.

Nope telling a player they need to be first choice is not the same as engineering a move. And even if it was engineered, the IRFU and the national team head coach organising a move so an international player is playing regular rugby instead of sitting on the bench my God what a crime against humanity

hey, I'm all for hyperbolae, but I never said it was a crime against He That Does Not EXIST. So I'm not sure what you're on about now. The move was engineered and everything you're saying is in agreement so I'm more than happy to leave it as is.

P.S. He wasn't sitting on the bench he was playing regularly at fullback which is arguably his better position.

[Workhorse]

hey, I'm all for hyperbolae, but I never said it was a crime against He That Does Not EXIST. So I'm not sure what you're on about now. The move was engineered and everything you're saying is in agreement so I'm more than happy to leave it as is.

P.S. He wasn't sitting on the bench he was playing regularly at fullback which is arguably his better position.

Here's how these things work.

Coach: You need to be first choice if you want to go to the WC and your current clubs first choice is the national first choice in both your positions
Player: Okay let me think about it
Player: Okay I think I should move so that I'm in the best position to go to the world cup
Coach: Right we'll try work something out that suits everyone.

So Kearney just disappears in this situation. Remember he was injured at the time Carbery was playing.

[Dave Cahill]

They smiled so much and waved their flags
As she saluted to the military band

[Oldschoolsocks]

hey, I'm all for hyperbolae, but I never said it was a crime against He That Does Not EXIST. So I'm not sure what you're on about now. The move was engineered and everything you're saying is in agreement so I'm more than happy to leave it as is.

P.S. He wasn't sitting on the bench he was playing regularly at fullback which is arguably his better position.

Here's how these things work.

Coach: You need to be first choice if you want to go to the WC and your current clubs first choice is the national first choice in both your positions
Player: Okay let me think about it
Player: Okay I think I should move so that I'm in the best position to go to the world cup
Coach: Right we'll try work something out that suits everyone.

So Kearney just disappears in this situation. Remember he was injured at the time Carbery was playing.

nobody seriously thinks that an uninjured Carbery wouldn't have got to that World Cup. He took Jean Kleyn ffs...