Pro14 R3: Leinster v Edinburgh Fri 11th Oct KO 19:35

[leinsterforever]

Leinster above any Irish province aren't overdoing it in terms of foreign signings.

Would I be happy if the Leinster-produced squad is slightly more so? Yes I would, but ignoring the benefits of external pros with knowledge, experience and different skill sets would be folly.

Don't agree that Leinster aren't overdoing it. Signing Tomane was pretty obviously overkill imo. Conor O'Brien can't get a game, let alone Tommy O'Brien and Gavin Mullin. They'll be left kicking their heels all season. Might get a few minutes here or there.

[cormac]

We've probably fewer non-Leinster born and/or bred players in the squad now than at any stage in the last 20 years.

[Serb]

Ah jaysus, the absolute nonsense about foreign players playing for Leinster. We’re a club with zero requirement for a player to be of any nationality to play for us.

Lucky for us, we do have a great academy full of fantastic players that we can pick from, but we can’t produce top quality players in every position all of the time — there will be players that don’t work out, or simply a lack of quality in specialist positions in particular and we use project players and non-Irish qualified players to plug those gaps.

Also, sometimes, a great player becomes available. We might not have a specific need for a player in that position, but they bring a different skill set and a new perspective on how the game should be played, and we should absolutely lap those players up and bring them in — adding diversity to the squad makes the entire team better.

James Lowe is a great example of that kind of player. Offloads unlike any Irish talent, you’ll often see him release the ball and standing up after he’s tackled and rucking over the ball — you rarely see that in northern hemisphere rugby, but now Larmour is doing it; guaranteed he was influenced by Lowe to look for that.

The reality is we produce far more Irish players than any other province, capping around 50 born and bred Irishmen every season, plus supplying maybe another dozen to the other three provinces; both Munster and Ulster routinely field teams that have less than 50% locally produced players in the team, when’s the last time that happened at Leinster? Probably multiple years ago.

The odd time we’ll get it wrong and we’ll sign a player who we don’t really need a season or two later as players matured faster than we expected them to — Tomane is probably one of those cases and I seriously doubt we’ll renew his contract when it expires at the end of this season.

[OTT]

ISA ISA ISA

[mildlyinterested]

Leinster above any Irish province aren't overdoing it in terms of foreign signings.

Would I be happy if the Leinster-produced squad is slightly more so? Yes I would, but ignoring the benefits of external pros with knowledge, experience and different skill sets would be folly.

Don't agree that Leinster aren't overdoing it. Signing Tomane was pretty obviously overkill imo. Conor O'Brien can't get a game, let alone Tommy O'Brien and Gavin Mullin. They'll be left kicking their heels all season. Might get a few minutes here or there.

Agree on Tomane, he was an unnessary signing as proven last season and now he is blocking the development of COB someone who showed a lot of promise last season when given an opportunity.

Disappointed in Leos non-rotation at 12, usually he does a very good job with getting young players gametime.

[leinsterforever]

To my mind the need for signings is getting less and less. The Celtic Cup seems to be a better development tool than the B&I Cup. The fact that players can get a run of games is huge. Then there's Lancaster's training methods. Him involving the academy in training seems to prepare them extremely well for first team action.

[mildlyinterested]

I think there's a case for 3-4 foreigners for different personalities and view points in the group..

[wixfjord]

It's mad, after the Euro final many here said we need to bring in more power to compete with Sarries and there was complaints that they had strengthened their squad considerably over the summer and we didn't.

It's great having a mainly home produced squad with local lads.

But we still need the impact and fresh ideas of a small smattering of top quality outside signings, particularly in times like these when we've most of the squad away.

Tomane has been really good over the last two games and deserves his spot over COB who I believe there are some fitness issues with. COB might've been given more time over last two games but I don't think on form you drop Tomane.

The other three are far and away ahead of the other available players in their position at this stage of the season.

[backrower8]

Agree on Tomane, he was an unnessary signing as proven last season and now he is blocking the development of COB someone who showed a lot of promise last season when given an opportunity.

Disappointed in Leos non-rotation at 12, usually he does a very good job with getting young players gametime.

+1

[backrower8]

I'd be surprised of many here care what Steve Thompson has to say

The accuracy of his opinions are in line with his lineout throwing

I don't agree with him (or Luke, or anyone else who has that opinion) but I can completely understand where they're coming from to be fair, I don't think it's a ridiculous opinion to have.

For me the issue isn't that it happens, it's that it happens too often, and I still can't understand (sorry, I know I bring this up all the time) why World Rugby didn't just put a cap on the number of residency qualified players in a match day squad. If they capped it at 2/3 players then the whole landscape changes, simple.

I really hate when people single out players though, it's not their fault that they've taken advantage of an opportunity provided to them and by and large they're busting a gut to be a good as they can possibly be for their adopted province/country and make a really positive impact. Rugby just isn't a big enough sport that we can do away with the residency rule and we need to be pretty liberal with it in order to grow the women's game too IMO.

As much as I don't want us to overdo it, it's great to be able to watch someone like J-Lo every week and it's really exciting that we're trying to develop someone like Salanoa.

+1

Once again the voice of balance and reason amongst the feeding mob.

[Ruckedtobits]

Ah jaysus, the absolute nonsense about foreign players playing for Leinster. We’re a club with zero requirement for a player to be of any nationality to play for us.

Lucky for us, we do have a great academy full of fantastic players that we can pick from, but we can’t produce top quality players in every position all of the time — there will be players that don’t work out, or simply a lack of quality in specialist positions in particular and we use project players and non-Irish qualified players to plug those gaps.

Also, sometimes, a great player becomes available. We might not have a specific need for a player in that position, but they bring a different skill set and a new perspective on how the game should be played, and we should absolutely lap those players up and bring them in — adding diversity to the squad makes the entire team better.

James Lowe is a great example of that kind of player. Offloads unlike any Irish talent, you’ll often see him release the ball and standing up after he’s tackled and rucking over the ball — you rarely see that in northern hemisphere rugby, but now Larmour is doing it; guaranteed he was influenced by Lowe to look for that.

The reality is we produce far more Irish players than any other province, capping around 50 born and bred Irishmen every season, plus supplying maybe another dozen to the other three provinces; both Munster and Ulster routinely field teams that have less than 50% locally produced players in the team, when’s the last time that happened at Leinster? Probably multiple years ago.

The odd time we’ll get it wrong and we’ll sign a player who we don’t really need a season or two later as players matured faster than we expected them to — Tomane is probably one of those cases and I seriously doubt we’ll renew his contract when it expires at the end of this season.

+1

Leinster have always, under at least the past 4 Head Coaches (Cheika, Joe , MO'C and Leo), recruited Overseas players who might contribute a different skill-set, unique experience or a positional attribute which we don't have for the forthcoming season. Some ask for and get longer initial contracts than we offer. That's the way a market works Some options fail, others blossom.

No Leinster Coach, in the past decade, has had to plan for the following season with a specific weakness in the Squad that he hasn't been allowed try to repair or mitigate by recruitment. I understand that the sole restriction which has been exercised has been limited to not initiating approaches to players from other Provinces. In every signing from other Provinces, the player or his Agent approached Leinster.

Leinster cannot ever wait for current Academy players to grow into the player we need to compete at the highest level in Europe. It is a fundamental tenet of the Club that we want to compete at that table every year and Nucifora has concurred with that objective. If that means an overseas player, so be it. If it has meant a NIQ, who might be a Project, Leinster have to validate their proposed signing by production of full details of their Depth Chart in that position.

In a professional sport where results are the core determinant of success, no other approach would be rational. Desires to have Irish-bred players constantly available in every position may be laudable to some but not to others, including me, if it is at the cost of possible success, every Season.

[Dave Cahill]

I don't agree with him (or Luke, or anyone else who has that opinion) but I can completely understand where they're coming from to be fair, I don't think it's a ridiculous opinion to have.

For me the issue isn't that it happens, it's that it happens too often, and I still can't understand (sorry, I know I bring this up all the time) why World Rugby didn't just put a cap on the number of residency qualified players in a match day squad. If they capped it at 2/3 players then the whole landscape changes, simple.

I really hate when people single out players though, it's not their fault that they've taken advantage of an opportunity provided to them and by and large they're busting a gut to be a good as they can possibly be for their adopted province/country and make a really positive impact. Rugby just isn't a big enough sport that we can do away with the residency rule and we need to be pretty liberal with it in order to grow the women's game too IMO.

As much as I don't want us to overdo it, it's great to be able to watch someone like J-Lo every week and it's really exciting that we're trying to develop someone like Salanoa.

f we were to put together a rugby team of Irish revolutionaries, Connolly, DeValera, Béaslaí, Constance Markievicz (thankfully, what with her being quite mad) and Erskine Childers couldn't play for Ireland under "Fat c**t"s rules!

[mildlyinterested]

Cian Kelleher an active participant at the captain's run today. So not injured.

[riocard911]

I don't agree with him (or Luke, or anyone else who has that opinion) but I can completely understand where they're coming from to be fair, I don't think it's a ridiculous opinion to have.

For me the issue isn't that it happens, it's that it happens too often, and I still can't understand (sorry, I know I bring this up all the time) why World Rugby didn't just put a cap on the number of residency qualified players in a match day squad. If they capped it at 2/3 players then the whole landscape changes, simple.

I really hate when people single out players though, it's not their fault that they've taken advantage of an opportunity provided to them and by and large they're busting a gut to be a good as they can possibly be for their adopted province/country and make a really positive impact. Rugby just isn't a big enough sport that we can do away with the residency rule and we need to be pretty liberal with it in order to grow the women's game too IMO.

As much as I don't want us to overdo it, it's great to be able to watch someone like J-Lo every week and it's really exciting that we're trying to develop someone like Salanoa.

f we were to put together a rugby team of Irish revolutionaries, Connolly, DeValera, Béaslaí, Constance Markievicz (thankfully, what with her being quite mad) and Erskine Childers couldn't play for Ireland under "Fat c**t"s rules!

p.s. Pearse's father was a Sassenach!!!

[LeRouxIsPHat]

Tomane has been really good over the last two games and deserves his spot over COB who I believe there are some fitness issues with. COB might've been given more time over last two games but I don't think on form you drop Tomane.

Interesting, I was thinking that his non selection pointed to a kick in the ass but hadn't heard anything. I know other players haven't played either but it's a bit different because they have more competition.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

f we were to put together a rugby team of Irish revolutionaries, Connolly, DeValera, Béaslaí, Constance Markievicz (thankfully, what with her being quite mad) and Erskine Childers couldn't play for Ireland under "Fat c**t"s rules!

Being dead probably rules them out too, although if EOS was the coach then he'd probably still pick them.

[blockhead]

This thread took a turn down a dark, xenophobic path since the team was announced, didn't it!
"Durty foreigners cummin over ere and takin our jobs" WTF?
Calling guys who have worn the blue shirt with pride and distinction "rejects" is way out of order in my book.

[neiliog93]

Sorry for contributing to the foreign player discussion on this thread (an off-topic segue if ever there was one) but we could do with a world class, big, mean, tight-head second row. Either as number 19 or starting. I think the way Sarries comprehensively outmuscled us showed that.

I love Fardy but he's a clever grafter of a 5/6, not a Brad Thorn or a Hines.

[Oldschool]

f we were to put together a rugby team of Irish revolutionaries, Connolly, DeValera, Béaslaí, Constance Markievicz (thankfully, what with her being quite mad) and Erskine Childers couldn't play for Ireland under "Fat c**t"s rules!

Being dead probably rules them out too, although if EOS was the coach then he'd probably still pick them.

All Munster qualified then?

[Oldschool]

Sorry for contributing to the foreign player discussion on this thread (an off-topic segue if ever there was one) but we could do with a world class, big, mean, tight-head second row. Either as number 19 or starting. I think the way Sarries comprehensively outmuscled us showed that.

I love Fardy but he's a clever grafter of a 5/6, not a Brad Thorn or a Hines.

Superman doesn't play rugby.
A SR of that quality is playing for his country.
We sign NIQs, partially because they are available during international windows.
Leinster by and large have got the number of NiQs in the squad right.
Occasionally, like Tomani, they've got it wrong as in not required.
You could argue and it has been mentioned that we didn't need to sign Cian Kelleher either.
Hindsight is 20/20 vision of course.
Pilot's remark about not wanting a large (excessive) number of NZers? is, in fairness, fair comment.
However when we signed JCB we needed a dig out at SH and he was and still is a good signing.
It would be mad, having invested in him, to then just ditch him. He may well, probably will, play for Ireland.