World cup warmups

[simonokeeffe]

speaking of the warm ups its good to see that PSA is still picking people out of position/crazy squad in general/not knowing his arse from his elbow with French team

we could well get lucky and have someone who isnt Parra and Michalak as their halfbacks

[LeRouxIsPHat]

I don't see the point in that kind of thing. You're really only bringing an extra outside back for rotation purposes in the first couple of games, why bother? To me it seems to be done with a view to not leaving guys out when in reality we've no need for them all.

It allows you a bit of leeway to select a guy in good form in one position ahead of a guy with no form in another position who's just there to make up the positional numbers. I think the comparison that SOK draws with a 6/2 split on the Australian bench recently is significant.

For example, Tommy Bowe is in pretty ordinary form at the moment, and from the accounts I've heard and read from people who have witnessed him training, he has been off the pace compared to some of the other wingers. Still, he's a thoroughly proven player at the highest level – five times a test Lion, Ireland's highest international try scorer currently active and the third highest in history, and a player who has been a significant part of all three of our recent Six Nations championship wins.

In contrast, Dave Kearney is looking sharp and has been hitting his straps in training. If he gets a shot against Wales and does much better than Bowe – or for that matter, if Felix Jones gets another shot and continues the form he showed in Cardiff – then you come to a very difficult decision where you are considering leaving out a proven big game player and a world class player on his day in Tommy Bowe in favour of either an aged pro very much in the winter of his career [Boss] or a young guy who has never shown anything at test level, finished the season poorly and very arguably isn't even the best Irish scrum-half at his club [Marmion].

I really don't rate Italy away from home; their results on the road are pretty atrocious. I think that if we only brought two scrum-halves, and if Reddan went down with a bug on the day before the match and Conor Murray got injured 15 minutes into it, we'd still beat them with Madigan at No9 for an hour. On the balance of probabilities, I'd rather that we make room for a back three player in conspicuously good form whilst retaining Bowe and/or Trimble in the squad to allow them time to regain form, rather than bring a third choice scrum-half as a break-glass-in-case-of-emergency option.

I still can't see the benefits tbh.

I know there's more doubts about them now but if we take it that Trimble and Bowe do travel and most of the other backs spots pick themselves, I think most agree that there are probably three back up positions up for grabs and after the Welsh game I said that they would go to Cave, Earls and Jones. Do you really add very much by adding Zebo, Luke, or DK to that group?

You could go with any combination there of course, so maybe drop Cave and Jones and go for Zebo, Earls, and Luke if you really want to have that spark in your back pocket, but you can make that choice without compromising at scrumhalf. Surely it would be better to lose the "break glass in case of emergency" centre and fullback from that scenario rather than a scrumhalf meaning we wouldn't have any cover at all?

Lastly, Joe has been very conservative in his selections. Think of all the guys who have returned from injury but not been selected because of a lack of games etc, therefore I think it's highly unlikely that he would tinker too much with the team if he had those extra options out wide, especially given the short window of opportunity to gain momentum before the French game. Even if you don't rate Italy, you'd imagine we'd want to use it as strong preparation to get ready for the French game.

[Logorrhea]

Kicking from 9 is far too important to Joe's gameplan for him to trust in anything but a specialist 9.

[offshorerules]

Kicking from 9 is far too important to Joe's gameplan for him to trust in anything but a specialist 9.

Spot on IMHO. Also the chase is far too important to him for him to take flakey wingers also.

[jezzer]

It'd be a small risk, but I'd consider only bringing two scrum-halves. We've got the easiest group in the competition with Canada [18th in the rankings], Romania [17th] and Italy [14th] and a favourable sequence of games. We're an hour's flight away.

You've got to ask yourself whether it's worth bringing a guy who is no great shakes at test level – Bossy or Marmion – in case we lose one of two specific players in the warm-up before the French game.

It's what I'd do, though I doubt Schmidt will. As awful as Boss was - and he was cr@p - he's still good enough to play Canada and Romania and for the team to win. I think Joe will value that more highly than having an extra three-quarter option to pick from in all the games.

Personally, I'd prefer having the option and calling up Bossy as emergency cover.

[Oldschool]

Kicking from 9 is far too important to Joe's gameplan for him to trust in anything but a specialist 9.

Spot on IMHO. Also the chase is far too important to him for him to take flakey wingers also.

Luke McGrath wou be third choice if a certain Aussie censored hadn't refused to pick him ahead of Boss last season.
I know he has flaws but this is Boss I'm comparing him to.
Anyway spilt milk I hope the Aussies bomb in their group.

[cwebber82]

Unlikely that Fitz or Darce will make the World Cup squad I would say.

Darce has very litte chance.

People are judging Luke on one warm up game. Luke was very good when he was selected against Scotland last March and his form for Leinster was good too. Luke is also a left winger. Think Joe will take four wingers (two right sided and two left sided) - Bowe, Trimble, Zebo and Luke. If Trimble doesn't make it then D Kearney gets in.

Don't think Felix Jones makes the cut. Zebo can cover full back, so can Luke and Bowe has played some rugby at full back. Madigan has played full back against Clermont in 2012 and did well there.

[Peg Leg]

Unlikely that Fitz or Darce will make the World Cup squad I would say.

Darce has very litte chance.

People are judging Luke on one warm up game. Luke was very good when he was selected against Scotland last March and his form for Leinster was good too. Luke is also a left winger. Think Joe will take four wingers (two right sided and two left sided) - Bowe, Trimble, Zebo and Luke. If Trimble doesn't make it then D Kearney gets in.

Don't think Felix Jones makes the cut. Zebo can cover full back, so can Luke and Bowe has played some rugby at full back. Madigan has played full back against Clermont in 2012 and did well there.

Poor Keet- who I think is a shoe in. Toss between Zebo & Jones, Trimble's fitness & Luke

[simonokeeffe]

dont think this got a mention but apparently Gatland dropped those guys from the Welsh squad via a group email, bit cold IMO

also I think we have an advantage over them for our game as more of our players have had (more) gametime preseason than theirs

[Ruckedtobits]

Although its not an easy call, Tommy Bowe looks the most vulnerable of the likely 14 backs at present. My current call would be:

Half-backs: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson; 5
Midfield: Henshaw, Payne, Madigan, Earls; 4
Back-three: Kearney, Zebo, Trimble, Bowe , Kearney D, Fitzgerald; 5

Front-row: Healy, McGrath, Ross, Moore, Bent / White, Best, Cronin, Strauss; 8
Second-row: O'Connell, Toner, Ryan, Henderson; 4
Back-row: Heaslip, O'Brien, O'Mahony, Henry, Murphy; 5

Undoubtedly, the strongest Irish Squad ever and some players of real quality left behind. Tommy O'Donnell most unfortunate along with Kilcoyne, Cave and McFadden. Murphy only one "lucky" to be picked.

We could do with another pure No 7 and possibly another No 13. Leavy and Ringrose might be solutions in a year's time. Leinster have a huge presence with 18 of 31.

[johng]

There are 32 players there. Plus. There is no choice between Bent and White if you are only taking 5 props. Especially with a half fit Healy.

[AdamK]

Although its not an easy call, Tommy Bowe looks the most vulnerable of the likely 14 backs at present. My current call would be:

Half-backs: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson; 5
Midfield: Henshaw, Payne, Madigan, Earls; 4
Back-three: Kearney, Zebo, Trimble, Bowe , Kearney D, Fitzgerald; 5

Front-row: Healy, McGrath, Ross, Moore, Bent / White, Best, Cronin, Strauss; 8
Second-row: O'Connell, Toner, Ryan, Henderson; 4
Back-row: Heaslip, O'Brien, O'Mahony, Henry, Murphy; 5

Undoubtedly, the strongest Irish Squad ever and some players of real quality left behind. Tommy O'Donnell most unfortunate along with Kilcoyne, Cave and McFadden. Murphy only one "lucky" to be picked.

We could do with another pure No 7 and possibly another No 13. Leavy and Ringrose might be solutions in a year's time. Leinster have a huge presence with 18 of 31.

Possibly off topic but I don't think TOD was gonna travel anyway, unless Henry was left at home.

Back on topic... It'll effect our pack leading into the season but we'll still have some quality backs to choose from.

[ChrisUppy]

Although its not an easy call, Tommy Bowe looks the most vulnerable of the likely 14 backs at present. My current call would be:

Half-backs: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson; 5
Midfield: Henshaw, Payne, Madigan, Earls; 4
Back-three: Kearney, Zebo, Trimble, Bowe , Kearney D, Fitzgerald; 5

Front-row: Healy, McGrath, Ross, Moore, Bent / White, Best, Cronin, Strauss; 8
Second-row: O'Connell, Toner, Ryan, Henderson; 4
Back-row: Heaslip, O'Brien, O'Mahony, Henry, Murphy; 5

Undoubtedly, the strongest Irish Squad ever and some players of real quality left behind. Tommy O'Donnell most unfortunate along with Kilcoyne, Cave and McFadden. Murphy only one "lucky" to be picked.

We could do with another pure No 7 and possibly another No 13. Leavy and Ringrose might be solutions in a year's time. Leinster have a huge presence with 18 of 31.

You have to cut one of those back three. You have 6 listed.

[Fireworks]

Although its not an easy call, Tommy Bowe looks the most vulnerable of the likely 14 backs at present. My current call would be:

Half-backs: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson; 5
Midfield: Henshaw, Payne, Madigan, Earls; 4
Back-three: Kearney, Zebo, Trimble, Bowe , Kearney D, Fitzgerald; 5

Front-row: Healy, McGrath, Ross, Moore, Bent / White, Best, Cronin, Strauss; 8
Second-row: O'Connell, Toner, Ryan, Henderson; 4
Back-row: Heaslip, O'Brien, O'Mahony, Henry, Murphy; 5

Undoubtedly, the strongest Irish Squad ever and some players of real quality left behind. Tommy O'Donnell most unfortunate along with Kilcoyne, Cave and McFadden. Murphy only one "lucky" to be picked.

We could do with another pure No 7 and possibly another No 13. Leavy and Ringrose might be solutions in a year's time. Leinster have a huge presence with 18 of 31.

You have to cut one of those back three. You have 6 listed.

The only one of those back three that I would think is safe is RK.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

A couple of journalists saying that Joe is thinking of stealing Hugonaut's wacky idea about only taking two scrumhalves.

Still just can't see the logic. What if Murray picked up a hamstring strain just before the French game and was going to miss that one and the quarter final but be fit after that? Would you cut him loose or take a chance on those two huge games with Madigan as back up?

[johng]

That's easy. Just cut the least useful member of the squad at that point and take in boss/marmion.

I'm guessing it would be an outside back.

[LeRouxIsPHat]

They'd have to be injured though...maybe get Dean Richards on board for the tournament?

[WarPoodle]

At the moment Bowe is living off reputation. Saying that it's a damn good reputation, but he didn't play particularly well in the 6 Nations and he was anonymous against Scotland. I think he'll travel anyway, but I'm not sure he deserves to. (Queue him getting the match winning try against New Zealand in the final...)

Darce shouldn't go, and I don't think Boss should either. Would like to see Marmion get a start. And really want to see what Dave Kearney can do with a start. He looked hangry when he came on against Scotland.

[johng]

They'd have to be injured though...maybe get Dean Richards on board for the tournament?

Heh heh. You spotted the slight flaw in my plan.

[Golf Man]

Although its not an easy call, Tommy Bowe looks the most vulnerable of the likely 14 backs at present. My current call would be:

Half-backs: Murray, Reddan, Boss, Sexton, Jackson; 5
Midfield: Henshaw, Payne, Madigan, Earls; 4
Back-three: Kearney, Zebo, Trimble, Bowe , Kearney D, Fitzgerald; 5

Front-row: Healy, McGrath, Ross, Moore, Bent / White, Best, Cronin, Strauss; 8
Second-row: O'Connell, Toner, Ryan, Henderson; 4
Back-row: Heaslip, O'Brien, O'Mahony, Henry, Murphy; 5

Undoubtedly, the strongest Irish Squad ever and some players of real quality left behind. Tommy O'Donnell most unfortunate along with Kilcoyne, Cave and McFadden. Murphy only one "lucky" to be picked.

We could do with another pure No 7 and possibly another No 13. Leavy and Ringrose might be solutions in a year's time. Leinster have a huge presence with 18 of 31.

As other shjave pointed out you have one too many outside backs
Those in contention with Bowe

- Trimble - has been out for the guts of a year and injured again on his comeback
- Fitzgerald - only ok v Scotland with plenty of mistakes, has barely played under Schmidt, injured all the time
- Zebo - played a lot in the last year but known that Schmidt has issues with him
- D Kearney - solid player who has picked up most of hisps through injury - 1 good break v Scotland

I'm notsure how in that light you can say that Bowe is the most vulnerable - since 2009 he has been picked by every coach (including two Lions coaches) when fit - entirely suited to our gameplan - didn't play particularly well in his one outing to date

Bowe and Rob Kearney are the guaranteed selections in the back 3 at the moment - All being fit Rob Kearney is 10% going to start v Italy -I'd suggest that Bowe is nearly as likely - maybe 98% certain