France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

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Dave Cahill
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Dave Cahill »

simonokeeffe wrote: Joe has never seemed to have been a huge fan of Conway's, on current form I wouldnt mind and he may well be 23, Stockdale has the higher ceiling
Thats not really the case though - he got a lot of Leinster starts under Schmidt and all his international caps too. He gave him his first 6 Nations cap, started both Japanese tests, started him against South Africa and Fiji and he played in all three Autumn Internationals.

I'd say he is a very big fan of Conway's
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by El Diablo »

If you were to pick on form, you would have to pick Conan ahead of Stander. Stander is a great player and a leader on the pitch but too predictable in terms of his ball carrying. The French will line him up all day long. Conan has much better hands and will look for the offload more than Stander (I appreciate this could be a negative for selection with Joe!).

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by simonokeeffe »

Dave Cahill wrote:
simonokeeffe wrote: Joe has never seemed to have been a huge fan of Conway's, on current form I wouldnt mind and he may well be 23, Stockdale has the higher ceiling
Thats not really the case though - he got a lot of Leinster starts under Schmidt and all his international caps too. He gave him his first 6 Nations cap, started both Japanese tests, started him against South Africa and Fiji and he played in all three Autumn Internationals.

I'd say he is a very big fan of Conway's
shouldve added at international level

he has mostly seemed to have been behind other players though (for most of Joe's) tenure, there's obviously been a cull now at provincial level and Conway is ahead of Sweetnam now
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Dave Cahill »

El Diablo wrote:If you were to pick on form, you would have to pick Conan ahead of Stander. Stander is a great player and a leader on the pitch but too predictable in terms of his ball carrying. The French will line him up all day long. Conan has much better hands and will look for the offload more than Stander (I appreciate this could be a negative for selection with Joe!).
Stander is an top international class blindside but a Pro14 quality number 8. He is, as you say, too one dimensional at 8 - but at 6 a lot of those negatives become benefits and he is a hard worker.

However, we seem to be in thrall to the concept of POM being an international - why, I don't know. I'd go so far to say that Munster erred in making such a big deal of keeping him, if he were let go and a top quality number 8 signed, they'd have a far better back row with Stander at 6, Cloete at 7 and the new guy at 8.

If anyone can give a positive review of POMs play over the last two years without mentioning the lineout, theres a bag of jellies in it for them.



edit: Stander at 6...
Last edited by Dave Cahill on January 30th, 2018, 11:41 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Oldschool »

Dave Cahill wrote:
El Diablo wrote:If you were to pick on form, you would have to pick Conan ahead of Stander. Stander is a great player and a leader on the pitch but too predictable in terms of his ball carrying. The French will line him up all day long. Conan has much better hands and will look for the offload more than Stander (I appreciate this could be a negative for selection with Joe!).
Stander is an top international class blindside but a Pro14 quality number 8. He is, as you say, too one dimensional at 8 - but at 6 a lot of those negatives become benefits and he is a hard worker.

However, we seem to be in thrall to the concept of POM being an international - why, I don't know. I'd go so far to say that Munster erred in making such a big deal of keeping him, if he were let go and a top quality number 8 signed, they'd have a far better back row with Stander at 8, Cloete at 7 and the new guy at 8.

If anyone can give a positive review of POMs play over the last two years without mentioning the lineout, theres a bag of jellies in it for them.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by LeRouxIsPHat »

I'm guessing POM and Stander are set in stone for Saturday but I'd like to see Conan start next week and then at least one other game. Don't really care if it's at 6 or 8, or if Stander moves across or is left out, but he's good enough to be starting and I think we should rotate a little bit. For a while I felt he was playing well but not at his very best, but actually his all round game has been outstanding so the slight lack of big bursts up the middle is irrelevant really.

POM, Stander, and Josh starting this week, with Jordi on the bench, followed by Stander, Conan, and Josh next week, with Leavy on the bench, sounds very good to me.

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by sunshiner1 »

However, we seem to be in thrall to the concept of POM being an international - why, I don't know. I'd go so far to say that Munster erred in making such a big deal of keeping him
Agreed. POM is good but just good. That said Stander, POM and JVDF seems fairly well-balanced so here's hoping.

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by hugonaut »

Dave Cahill wrote:
simonokeeffe wrote: Joe has never seemed to have been a huge fan of Conway's, on current form I wouldnt mind and he may well be 23, Stockdale has the higher ceiling
Thats not really the case though - he got a lot of Leinster starts under Schmidt and all his international caps too. He gave him his first 6 Nations cap, started both Japanese tests, started him against South Africa and Fiji and he played in all three Autumn Internationals.

I'd say he is a very big fan of Conway's
It depends on what you mean by 'a big fan" – I think that JS has responded pragmatically and reasonably to the upsurge in Conway's form over the last 16-18 months. Did he go out on a limb to select him at any time when he wasn't in good form? I don't think so.

I don't think that Joe is a "very big fan of Conway's", in the same way I don't he's a particular fan of any player who he hasn't coached a lot previously, or who hasn't done a lot in the international game, or who he hasn't come to know very well in an off-pitch capacity.

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by olaf the fat »

"France's preparations for Saturday's Six Nations opener against Ireland have been disrupted by a stomach bug which has hit three players." (from the indo)

The lads pigged out on the cheap nutella?
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by simonokeeffe »

Tolofua ruled out, Guirado expected to recover from his tummy bug, dicey times for them at hooker, other no2 in squad is uncapped
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Ruckedtobits »

This game could be a bit like playing the Ba Bas. Joe loves to dissect the opposition and pick out their weaknesses (and highlight their strengths). Even amongst French commentators there is real difficulty in trying to figure out who Brunel wll select.

Based on his tactical approach in the past, it is expected that Brunel woll select a big strong pack but with a surprise or two elsewhere - possibly the young outhalves. In the middle of the pitch, expect to see very physical centres, whilst Benjamin Fall is the favourite to get the 15 jersey. The wings and back-row are the biggest mysteries but Camara and Gourdon are top of the list for the flanker spots.

Playing against effectively a scratch team has big advantages but it unsettles the preparation when you're uncertain who are facing.

Expect Joe to get it right but this could be about how much pride this French XV have in the jersey. This is the start of auditions for France RWC2019.

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Oldschool »

olaf the fat wrote:"France's preparations for Saturday's Six Nations opener against Ireland have been disrupted by a stomach bug which has hit three players." (from the indo)

The lads pigged out on the cheap nutella?
War games - Lull the opposition into a false sense of optimism.
The Irish squad need to ignore all this fake news.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Oldschool »

simonokeeffe wrote:Tolofua ruled out, Guirado expected to recover from his tummy bug, dicey times for them at hooker, other no2 in squad is uncapped
More fake news.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Oldschool »

Ruckedtobits wrote:This game could be a bit like playing the Ba Bas. Joe loves to dissect the opposition and pick out their weaknesses (and highlight their strengths). Even amongst French commentators there is real difficulty in trying to figure out who Brunel wll select.

Based on his tactical approach in the past, it is expected that Brunel woll select a big strong pack but with a surprise or two elsewhere - possibly the young outhalves. In the middle of the pitch, expect to see very physical centres, whilst Benjamin Fall is the favourite to get the 15 jersey. The wings and back-row are the biggest mysteries but Camara and Gourdon are top of the list for the flanker spots.

Playing against effectively a scratch team has big advantages but it unsettles the preparation when you're uncertain who are facing.

Expect Joe to get it right but this could be about how much pride this French XV have in the jersey. This is the start of auditions for France RWC2019.
New coach - Back to basics, stop the rot, plenty of fake news and if the opposition buy it then game on.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by olaf the fat »

Old-school agreed, the over confidence is amazing considering the opposition. Reading the papers, sure it's just a matter of showing up and collecting a bonus point.

They are a pretty unknown force with a new coach - they could be anything from a rabble to world beaters.
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by mildlyinterested »

James Ryan to start over Toner according to indo

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by simonokeeffe »

ROC/Indo saying Healy, Ryan, JVDF to start
Cronin, Toner, Leavy on bench, no word on no 23

Much to Joe's chargrin I do not agree with the Toner/Ryan call at all at all. Wouldve preferred Murphy over Leavy too
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by Laighin Break »

simonokeeffe wrote:ROC/Indo saying Healy, Ryan, JVDF to start
Cronin, Toner, Leavy on bench, no word on no 23

Much to Joe's chargrin I do not agree with the Toner/Ryan call at all at all. Wouldve preferred Murphy over Leavy too
Obviously Murphy can cover more, but Leavy is more exciting a "finisher" to bring on - probably isn't far off Cronin with his ability "to change a game".

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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by simonokeeffe »

Laighin Break wrote:
simonokeeffe wrote:ROC/Indo saying Healy, Ryan, JVDF to start
Cronin, Toner, Leavy on bench, no word on no 23

Much to Joe's chargrin I do not agree with the Toner/Ryan call at all at all. Wouldve preferred Murphy over Leavy too
Obviously Murphy can cover more, but Leavy is more exciting a "finisher" to bring on - probably isn't far off Cronin with his ability "to change a game".
As a straight swap for certainly JVDF Leavy is definitely more impactful. Would be a bit of a gamble banking on any 2 of the backrow to last 80 and for there to be no early injuries

That said, such a hight tempo bench is exciting, looks like we're targeting their fitness
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Re: France v Ireland 4.45pm Sat 3rd February 2018

Post by jimbobjoe »

A fresh legged Leavy will punish tired teams in the last 20 more than Murphy would. He could be TBP difference maker.
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