Munster Thread 2012-2013

[ronk]

Being given a chance for a run of games at 9 with suitable tactics has Pienaar clearly the best in the world at what he does. He needed to move to make that happen. He's been more use to SA as an overseas player with outstanding form.

Players shouldn't squander their talent to be loyal mediocre players. Earls is a better 11, so it's a different comparison.

[Donny B.]

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[Xanthippe]

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[Munsterboy]

Being given a chance for a run of games at 9 with suitable tactics has Pienaar clearly the best in the world at what he does. He needed to move to make that happen. He's been more use to SA as an overseas player with outstanding form.

Players shouldn't squander their talent to be loyal mediocre players. Earls is a better 11, so it's a different comparison.

That's just your opinion and, with all due respect, it's irrelevant. Earls himself believes that given a run of games in the position, he could be better at 13 than he is on the wing. That's why he wants to play there, just as Pienaar wanted to play 9 and eventually moved in order to do so. Nobody here criticised the South African for that but then, he's not a Munster player...

[Amz]

Pienaar moved because he wasn't getting to play where he wanted at a particular team. The team obviously felt they were in a stronger place playing him where they played him, but he wasn't happy with that. He took the risk and moved.

If all of this talking to the press doesn't work out for him. Would Earls be willing to move to another club who'd be willing to accommodate him, so he'd get his "run of games at 13" so he could show what he believes he can do there?

[tackle-bag]

People seem to be ignoring the fact that Pienaar probably gets about three times as much cash from Ulster as he did from the Sharks. I think it's fair to assume that this was a significant factor in his decision to move.

[ronk]

People seem to be ignoring the fact that Pienaar probably gets about three times as much cash from Ulster as he did from the Sharks. I think it's fair to assume that this was a significant factor in his decision to move.

I'm sure he could have got offered more in England and/or France. Ulster took a big risk, they showed a lot of faith in him. He would have been getting national team money too though AFAIK and giving up his place in the national team (which he had to win back). I think he's a better player for going to Ulster, much like the change was what brought Bowe on to the next level.

[Amz]

I guess the point I was hoping to make was, does Keet expect the team to change for him and if not, why doesn't he STFU and earn his spot, or move to a team who acknowledge and appreciate his "talent" at 13.

[tackle-bag]

People seem to be ignoring the fact that Pienaar probably gets about three times as much cash from Ulster as he did from the Sharks. I think it's fair to assume that this was a significant factor in his decision to move.

I'm sure he could have got offered more in England and/or France. Ulster took a big risk, they showed a lot of faith in him. He would have been getting national team money too though AFAIK and giving up his place in the national team (which he had to win back). I think he's a better player for going to Ulster, much like the change was what brought Bowe on to the next level.

France, definitely. England, almost certainly not. Salary cap aside, there are only two or three clubs in England that can compete with the Irish sides in terms of salaries for world class players and the only one of those that needs a player matching Pienaar's description is Saracens.

[janeymac08]

I guess the point I was hoping to make was, does Keet expect the team to change for him and if not, why doesn't he STFU and earn his spot, or move to a team who acknowledge and appreciate his "talent" at 13.

21 of his 26 Heineken Cup caps has been at 13 (2 on the wing and 3 at fullback).

[Amz]

So what's he whinging for?
He should HTFU

[janeymac08]

double post

[janeymac08]

People seem to be ignoring the fact that Pienaar probably gets about three times as much cash from Ulster as he did from the Sharks. I think it's fair to assume that this was a significant factor in his decision to move.

I'm sure he could have got offered more in England and/or France. Ulster took a big risk, they showed a lot of faith in him. He would have been getting national team money too though AFAIK and giving up his place in the national team (which he had to win back). I think he's a better player for going to Ulster, much like the change was what brought Bowe on to the next level.

France, definitely. England, almost certainly not. Salary cap aside, there are only two or three clubs in England that can compete with the Irish sides in terms of salaries for world class players and the only one of those that needs a player matching Pienaar's description is Saracens.

Pienaar has spoken about some sort of religious experience that led him to come to Ulster.

Ruan Pienaar, the multi-talented scrumhalf from Bloemfontein, speaks softly, but his carefully chosen words are marked with fierce passion.

“I had many offers from different places, France, England, you name it. But I have always believed with my Christianity that there’s so much more to life than rugby. I said to my wife before we came here that we had to be strong in our faith and I believe that God gave me a door to walk through here at Ulster.

“Being here gives me an enormous sense of purpose, I am not just here for rugby, I’m here to touch lives.”

http://www.irishtimes.com/newspaper/spo ... 21989.html

[ronk]

Being given a chance for a run of games at 9 with suitable tactics has Pienaar clearly the best in the world at what he does. He needed to move to make that happen. He's been more use to SA as an overseas player with outstanding form.

Players shouldn't squander their talent to be loyal mediocre players. Earls is a better 11, so it's a different comparison.

That's just your opinion and, with all due respect, it's irrelevant. Earls himself believes that given a run of games in the position, he could be better at 13 than he is on the wing. That's why he wants to play there, just as Pienaar wanted to play 9 and eventually moved in order to do so. Nobody here criticised the South African for that but then, he's not a Munster player...

I think plenty of people criticised Pienaar. I didn't, but I also didn't expect him to shine quite that much. Ulster put him front and centre rather than relying on him as a utility back and it worked out masterfully.

Players aren't always the best judge, Horgan thought he was a centre, D'Arcy didn't think he was a 12.

[janeymac08]

So what's he whinging for?
He should HTFU

Only whinging about what he said is about here.

http://www.htfu.com/wallpapers/jbl.jpg

[Munsterboy]

Being given a chance for a run of games at 9 with suitable tactics has Pienaar clearly the best in the world at what he does. He needed to move to make that happen. He's been more use to SA as an overseas player with outstanding form.

Players shouldn't squander their talent to be loyal mediocre players. Earls is a better 11, so it's a different comparison.

That's just your opinion and, with all due respect, it's irrelevant. Earls himself believes that given a run of games in the position, he could be better at 13 than he is on the wing. That's why he wants to play there, just as Pienaar wanted to play 9 and eventually moved in order to do so. Nobody here criticised the South African for that but then, he's not a Munster player...

I think plenty of people criticised Pienaar. I didn't, but I also didn't expect him to shine quite that much. Ulster put him front and centre rather than relying on him as a utility back and it worked out masterfully.

Players aren't always the best judge, Horgan thought he was a centre, D'Arcy didn't think he was a 12.

Sure, Earls may be wrong about his best position. Personally I think he struggles with the defensive organisation required of a 13. I just don't think there's anything wrong with him saying he wants to be an OC, particularly when he acknowledges that he can't be selfish about it and will have to defer to the needs of his team and his coach.

[munster#1]

Some very over the top posts here from the normal crew. Earls has said he sees himself as a 13 and wants to play there, what is the issue? He hasn't come out and said if he isn't playing 13 he is leaving, or that he refuses to play anywhere else. If mcfadden stated that he sees himself as a 12 and let joe know, i doubt there would be any issue from any of ye?

[Cianostays]

Some posters on here, myself included, would think Ferg would be a little bit petulant to say he hated playing in another position though. Preferring a position is absoloutley fine but was it really necessary and or clever of Earls to say he hated playing 11?

[tackle-bag]

Some very over the top posts here from the normal crew. Earls has said he sees himself as a 13 and wants to play there, what is the issue? He hasn't come out and said if he isn't playing 13 he is leaving, or that he refuses to play anywhere else. If mcfadden stated that he sees himself as a 12 and let joe know, i doubt there would be any issue from any of ye?

Excellent post. This thread has devoted far too much time to what is, in my view, a completely irrelevant issue. "Attacking player caught up in 'desire to play in position that sees more of the ball' shocker". Good wingers who are sh!te fullbacks have been doing it for years - Conway looks likely to be the next player to fit this description.

Most people seem to agree that Earls is a much better 11 than he is a 13, but also accept that he has improved considerably in the latter position. Unless he starts actively undermining the management, or refusing to tog out on the wing, he's entitled to his view provided also that he gives 100% on the field of play. I don't think I have ever seen him do otherwise. Earls is a superb attacking threat whose best years are yet to come. He has had some superb games for Munster, Ireland and (despite a horrific start to his tour) the Lions. People on this forum need to stop giving him such a hard time just because he speaks his mind.

[hugonaut]

Some very over the top posts here from the normal crew. Earls has said he sees himself as a 13 and wants to play there, what is the issue? He hasn't come out and said if he isn't playing 13 he is leaving, or that he refuses to play anywhere else. If mcfadden stated that he sees himself as a 12 and let joe know, i doubt there would be any issue from any of ye?

Excellent post. This thread has devoted far too much time to what is, in my view, a completely irrelevant issue. "Attacking player caught up in 'desire to play in position that sees more of the ball' shocker". Good wingers who are sh!te fullbacks have been doing it for years - Conway looks likely to be the next player to fit this description.

Most people seem to agree that Earls is a much better 11 than he is a 13, but also accept that he has improved considerably in the latter position. Unless he starts actively undermining the management, or refusing to tog out on the wing, he's entitled to his view provided also that he gives 100% on the field of play. I don't think I have ever seen him do otherwise. Earls is a superb attacking threat whose best years are yet to come. He has had some superb games for Munster, Ireland and (despite a horrific start to his tour) the Lions. People on this forum need to stop giving him such a hard time just because he speaks his mind.

"I absolutely hate playing 11" is the quote that has caused raised eye-brows, not "I want to be considered as a 13".