RWC 2023: Ireland

[johng]

Robbie Henshaw will be half my age by then!

[rooster]

Bid to be announced tomorrow.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/irish-int ... -unveiled/

Tomorrow morning in The Royal School Armagh I hope it goes on to be a successful bid as it would be fantastic for Ireland as a whole

[cormac]

Bid to be announced tomorrow.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/irish-int ... -unveiled/

Tomorrow morning in The Royal School Armagh I hope it goes on to be a successful bid as it would be fantastic for Ireland as a whole

Likely to be up against South Africa and Italy. If they produce competent bids it'll be hard to beat them. They're likely to be able to offer superior capacity.

[rooster]

Bid to be announced tomorrow.

http://www.rte.ie/sport/rugby/irish-int ... -unveiled/

Tomorrow morning in The Royal School Armagh I hope it goes on to be a successful bid as it would be fantastic for Ireland as a whole

Likely to be up against South Africa and Italy. If they produce competent bids it'll be hard to beat them. They're likely to be able to offer superior capacity.

Will be tough to get capacity, I thought perhaps some details today but really just an official announcement that the 2 governments along with the IRFU with the backing of the GAA for venues are putting a bid in.

[blockhead]

From the IT

The Government is expected to announce it is prepared to fully underwrite the €100 million-€120 million fee that would have to be paid to World Rugby (formerly the International Rugby Board) to host the tournament in 2023, or possibly 2027.

Approximately 11 stadiums are required to make a bid. The IRFU can provide four – the Aviva Stadium and the RDS in Dublin, Thomond Park in Limerick, and Ravenhill in Belfast.
The rest will be provided by the GAA.
Under the deal reached last month, the 82,000-capacity Croke Park would be used for at least both semi-finals and the final, with a capacity of at least 60,000 required for those games. The stadium could be used for as many as seven games.
GAA congress delegates have voted to put forward Semple Stadium in Thurles, MacHale Park in Castlebar, Pearse Stadium in Galway, Gaelic Grounds in Limerick, Páirc Uí Chaoimh in Cork and Casement Park in Belfast. Páirc Uí Chaoimh this month received permission for a €70 million upgrade, while Casement Park’s inclusion hinges upon permission for a revamp.

Sportsground to miss out it seems. Although it would have to be expanded to about 15k to be considered I suppose. If its not going to happen for this then when?

[Dave Cahill]

From the IT

The Government is expected to announce it is prepared to fully underwrite the €100 million-€120 million fee that would have to be paid to World Rugby (formerly the International Rugby Board) to host the tournament in 2023, or possibly 2027.

Approximately 11 stadiums are required to make a bid. The IRFU can provide four – the Aviva Stadium and the RDS in Dublin, Thomond Park in Limerick, and Ravenhill in Belfast.
The rest will be provided by the GAA.
Under the deal reached last month, the 82,000-capacity Croke Park would be used for at least both semi-finals and the final, with a capacity of at least 60,000 required for those games. The stadium could be used for as many as seven games.
GAA congress delegates have voted to put forward Semple Stadium in Thurles, MacHale Park in Castlebar, Pearse Stadium in Galway, Gaelic Grounds in Limerick, Páirc Uí Chaoimh in Cork and Casement Park in Belfast. Páirc Uí Chaoimh this month received permission for a €70 million upgrade, while Casement Park’s inclusion hinges upon permission for a revamp.

Sportsground to miss out it seems. Although it would have to be expanded to about 15k to be considered I suppose. If its not going to happen for this then when?

As things currently stand wrt to ownership, never.

No point in wasting money either on an over large white elephant that becomes an albatross around Connachts neck.

There are two grounds in Connacht as part of the bid

[blockhead]

From the IT

The Government is expected to announce it is prepared to fully underwrite the €100 million-€120 million fee that would have to be paid to World Rugby (formerly the International Rugby Board) to host the tournament in 2023, or possibly 2027.

Approximately 11 stadiums are required to make a bid. The IRFU can provide four – the Aviva Stadium and the RDS in Dublin, Thomond Park in Limerick, and Ravenhill in Belfast.
The rest will be provided by the GAA.
Under the deal reached last month, the 82,000-capacity Croke Park would be used for at least both semi-finals and the final, with a capacity of at least 60,000 required for those games. The stadium could be used for as many as seven games.
GAA congress delegates have voted to put forward Semple Stadium in Thurles, MacHale Park in Castlebar, Pearse Stadium in Galway, Gaelic Grounds in Limerick, Páirc Uí Chaoimh in Cork and Casement Park in Belfast. Páirc Uí Chaoimh this month received permission for a €70 million upgrade, while Casement Park’s inclusion hinges upon permission for a revamp.

Sportsground to miss out it seems. Although it would have to be expanded to about 15k to be considered I suppose. If its not going to happen for this then when?

As things currently stand wrt to ownership, never.

No point in wasting money either on an over large white elephant that becomes an albatross around Connachts neck.

There are two grounds in Connacht as part of the bid

I'm not disagreeing with you but, it would be nice from a legacy pov to have something to show for it after the tournament was over. The GAA will have plenty of revamped stadia as their legacy. If Connacht is to continue to grow then a bigger ground would be a necessity I would think. Leinster, Munster and Ulster have shown that increasing capacity increases ticket sales even though they were not selling out the previous stadia's. Build it and they will come, as it were.

[Dave Cahill]

Well its a long way away, but if everything were to remain equal, one would hope that the legacy would be a sufficient increase in Connachts crowds and interest in Rugby generally to fill the Sportsground regularly first of all.

Building a 15k ground is not the same as 15k people showing up. Ulster and Leinster were at the max of their capacity and moved, the increase in numbers drove the increase in capacity (amongst other things like corporate and family-friendly facilities), not the other way around. In Munster we've seen what happens when you add too much capacity, you remove the scarcity value of the ticket and when theres always biscuits in the tin, whats the point of biscuits

[rooster]

Well its a long way away, but if everything were to remain equal, one would hope that the legacy would be a sufficient increase in Connachts crowds and interest in Rugby generally to fill the Sportsground regularly first of all.

Building a 15k ground is not the same as 15k people showing up. Ulster and Leinster were at the max of their capacity and moved, the increase in numbers drove the increase in capacity (amongst other things like corporate and family-friendly facilities), not the other way around. In Munster we've seen what happens when you add too much capacity, you remove the scarcity value of the ticket and when theres always biscuits in the tin, whats the point of biscuits

I like the biscuits analogy Dave, perfectly correct though any professional in the marketing business will tell you never to over supply if you want to sell out a venue, too much of anything requires a price slump to shift the surplus.

[blockhead]

Well its a long way away, but if everything were to remain equal, one would hope that the legacy would be a sufficient increase in Connachts crowds and interest in Rugby generally to fill the Sportsground regularly first of all.

Building a 15k ground is not the same as 15k people showing up. Ulster and Leinster were at the max of their capacity and moved, the increase in numbers drove the increase in capacity (amongst other things like corporate and family-friendly facilities), not the other way around. In Munster we've seen what happens when you add too much capacity, you remove the scarcity value of the ticket and when theres always biscuits in the tin, whats the point of biscuits

But DC, it was the other way around. Look back at the attendances for Old TP, Donnybrook and Ravers. Not selling out, no queues around the corner (apart from big interpros and the odd Heino game). When we moved or revamped the attendances shot up, doubled in our case, even trebled. The RDS crowd now has 1000s of people who've probably never been to Donnybrook, same with TP and Ravers.

[Dave Cahill]

Well its a long way away, but if everything were to remain equal, one would hope that the legacy would be a sufficient increase in Connachts crowds and interest in Rugby generally to fill the Sportsground regularly first of all.

Building a 15k ground is not the same as 15k people showing up. Ulster and Leinster were at the max of their capacity and moved, the increase in numbers drove the increase in capacity (amongst other things like corporate and family-friendly facilities), not the other way around. In Munster we've seen what happens when you add too much capacity, you remove the scarcity value of the ticket and when theres always biscuits in the tin, whats the point of biscuits

But DC, it was the other way around. Look back at the attendances for Old TP, Donnybrook and Ravers. Not selling out, no queues around the corner (apart from big interpros and the odd Heino game). When we moved or revamped the attendances shot up, doubled in our case, even trebled. The RDS crowd now has 1000s of people who've probably never been to Donnybrook, same with TP and Ravers.

We were selling out, not everyone was showing up, but we were pretty much sold out most weeks (one of the drivers behind the leagues current attendence gauging method ipof). That in itself was a problem because we were completely dependent on the opposition not playing silly buggers with their allocation so we could have some capacity available for walkups - we used to put them on sale in Spar if you recall. There was a wait list for season tickets because we were maxed out there too what with the opposition allocation taken into account. We had begun bringing the bigger games elsewhere because we had simply reached capacity. We were in the process of redeveloping Donnybrook and we dipped our toe in the water at the RDS in 2005 and the following season ditched the Donnybrook redevelopment and committed ourselves to the RDS for the season following that. That was done in the belief that the numbers were already there.

You mentioned the folks who only went to the big interpros and the euro games - they were surveyed and a significant amount of responses indicated that the reason was the lack of Corporate and/or family friendly facilities in the Brook, they also indicated strongly that they'd change their attendance pattern in a better environment with better catering, more space for kids, and a genuine corporate event option. Even at that it was hard f%~king work in that first season for Keira and Ian to keep the bodies rolling through the gates. There were pretty much two physical events (one corporate and one for the supporters) at each match and every game had a number of ticketing promotions as well.

People forget that the numbers were initially quite low until the marketing began to seep into peoples consciousness - we were intially about 9/9.5k before the interpros really got things moving. There were big crowds for Connacht and Ulster and they created a lot of returners that fed into the crowds for Ospreys and (I think) Cardiff after christmas.

[paddyor]

Rupeni Caucau not so hot on the bidding process
https://twitter.com/AllBlacks/status/540811119086927872

[leinster4life13]

Rupeni Caucau not so hot on the bidding process
https://twitter.com/AllBlacks/status/540811119086927872

HA, he has a point, the bidding process is a joke, all the horse trading that goes on, bordering on FIFA territory. If any games are played in Cardiff or Scotland It will be a disgrace though, sick of every EU WC getting a Cardiff game.

[simonokeeffe]

love how someone replied to him maybe you should have played more tests for Fiji

odds are good for us with IRB based here, desirable location, tv friendly timezone, access, accommodation, one location, sponsor friendly, local crowds, not had it before (properly)

but agree with sentiment it would be a travesty if Welsh or Scots got a home pool so to speak. Aside from unfair advantage makes for a much better tournament to have it in one country

who else is in bidding for it?

[simonno6]

Rupeni Caucau not so hot on the bidding process
https://twitter.com/AllBlacks/status/540811119086927872

It's not him!

[sheepshagger]

Hope nobody is expecting to go to any of the 'big' games without selling an arm or a leg.

The larger UK venues are sold out already for next year, the smaller stadia here will just push up process as demand will easily outstrip supply

As has already been pointed out here, you can't just build stadiums for the event that will never get used properly again. Oh and for those that say 'well NZ did it'. Yeah they did but they'll never get it again, the competition has outgrown them.

The IRB hosting fee alone is (IIRC) over 100 million euro and that's just for signing the contract - think with your head people not your heart!!

[All Blacks nil]

I'm a little disappointed that no-one has tried to pick Ireland's XV for the opener yet. Surely it is not to early

[simonokeeffe]

Hope nobody is expecting to go to any of the 'big' games without selling an arm or a leg.

The larger UK venues are sold out already for next year, the smaller stadia here will just push up process as demand will easily outstrip supply

As has already been pointed out here, you can't just build stadiums for the event that will never get used properly again. Oh and for those that say 'well NZ did it'. Yeah they did but they'll never get it again, the competition has outgrown them.

The IRB hosting fee alone is (IIRC) over 100 million euro and that's just for signing the contract - think with your head people not your heart!!

think of the billion or so euro that will go into the economy and upsurge in interest in rugby

[TerenureJim]

Good bit of news on Croker

http://www.joe.ie/sport/croke-park-to-b ... and/478353

Definitely would add to match day facilities and services for any RWC games potentially to be played there.

[simonokeeffe]

Planning permission refused for Casement Park in Belfast, new 38k GAA stadium, one of the proposed venues for our bid