johng wrote:No but it's really p1ssing me off. Proper panto crowd. We are going the way of Glasgow Ulster and the Welsh.
The ‘us’ was general, don’t like it myself but I love when other teams do it to us it usually means we are winning or the specific target is playing well. I think panto is the right word for the Christmas Lansdowne match, people are absolutely baloobas and the rugby is just part of their show. We are not perfect but the RDS is a level below some of the other grounds like Glasgow and Munster. Biased of course.
"Horrocks went one way, Taylor the other and I was left holding the bloody hyphen!"
Dave Cahill wrote:I though it was a pen, but I can see why the ref didn't. The Saints player is under no obligation to deviate his run. If he stays behind the ball and doesn't change his line he can legally clatter the bejesus out of mcgrath
He clearly targeted McGrath. Ran straight at him. I cant understand how that isnt obstruction. He was never looking to receive the ball. Seemed clear cut to me. Thankfully it didnt matter.
+1. Blatant penalty. Targeted the tackler and successfully took him out. Doesn't matter, but it was a poor decision,
thats all fine, but none of that is against the laws as long as you start your run from behind the ball and don't change your line.
Take a look at virtually every try our backs scored between 2000 and 2011 using the Gaffney loop. Its all dependent on one simple fact - you can take a guy out deliberately if you do it right
Dave Cahill wrote:thats all fine, but none of that is against the laws as long as you start your run from behind the ball and don't change your line.
Take a look at virtually every try our backs scored between 2000 and 2011 using the Gaffney loop. Its all dependent on one simple fact - you can take a guy out deliberately if you do it right
Shirley every crossing penalty is the same thing, but the ref blows it. This guy was in front of the ball carrier and interfered with the tackler, not a tackler, but the tackler.
johng wrote:No but it's really p1ssing me off. Proper panto crowd. We are going the way of Glasgow Ulster and the Welsh.
Agree. The team went of at half time with boo's ringing in their ears; after pretty much a scintillating first half performance scoring 31 pts. Cannot stand booing - regardless.
Dave Cahill wrote:thats all fine, but none of that is against the laws as long as you start your run from behind the ball and don't change your line.
Take a look at virtually every try our backs scored between 2000 and 2011 using the Gaffney loop. Its all dependent on one simple fact - you can take a guy out deliberately if you do it right
So keeping with the theme the key issue is that HE's BEHIND YOU!
Dave Cahill wrote:thats all fine, but none of that is against the laws as long as you start your run from behind the ball and don't change your line.
Take a look at virtually every try our backs scored between 2000 and 2011 using the Gaffney loop. Its all dependent on one simple fact - you can take a guy out deliberately if you do it right
Deliberately preventing a player making a tackle very much is illegal, which is exactly what he did. Had a Munster mate at the game who, while he wanted us to win, wanted Nirthampton to make a game of it. Even he was flabbergasted that it was allowed. Seemed a clear case of obstruction.
Nope, no its not. If you're onside, behind the ball, and don't change your line then you have no obligation to get out of the way.
By your interpretation the second Ringrose try shouldn't have stood - Henshaw, coming from an onside position behind the ball and without changing his line gets a good block on Biggar who is then unable to get to Lowe on time. No try?
Dave Cahill wrote:By your interpretation the second Ringrose try shouldn't have stood - Henshaw, coming from an onside position behind the ball and without changing his line gets a good block on Biggar who is then unable to get to Lowe on time. No try?
Dave Cahill wrote:By your interpretation the second Ringrose try shouldn't have stood - Henshaw, coming from an onside position behind the ball and without changing his line gets a good block on Biggar who is then unable to get to Lowe on time. No try?
Biggar got the tackle on Lowe.
So what? The act is the penalty, not the outcome - the outcome defines the sanction for the act. The delay caused by the "obstruction" caused him to be unable to make a dominant tackle, as he would have done if he weren't "obstructed".
Of course Biggar wasn't obstructed as Henshaw was onside and behind the ball when he started his run, the line of which didn't change. And the same for McGrath, he got caught by a classic Gaffney loop
The irony is that both teams got the move from the same coach - it's probably Alan Gaffneys biggest legacy.
johng wrote:No but it's really p1ssing me off. Proper panto crowd. We are going the way of Glasgow Ulster and the Welsh.
The booing of Biggar when he came off wasn't great. Rugby isn't about booing players. Similarly though, he needs to shut his mouth and respect the officials.
Joe Schmidt was at the match.
Don't know if many of you saw it but Ch4 showed a shot of him at the end of the match, grinning from ear to ear.
He's still a true blue.
Mirror, Mirror on the Wall who's the greatest player of them all? It is Drico your majesty.
I see your point and Its an interesting one. When the ref was talking to his TMO he said that McGrath looked for the contact and so it wasn't an issue. Is that the way the ref's look for it now? If the defender chooses to hit the dummy runner its okay? For me the dummy runner hit McGrath rather than the other way around.
Either way, its a game where coaches and players talk about creating the right picture for the referee and referee interpretation is key. Its never as clear cut as you have set out.
I think both tries should have been chalked off tbh. I don't think you should be allowed to run in front of the ball-carrier and bump out of the way a player who was on a line to get to the ball-carrier. It's different if the tackler had a clear path to the player with the ball but chose to go to the dummy runner. League has it way better defined what a dummy runner can and can't do as regards obstruction.
I think the focus is in the wrong place here, it was Ringrose who was the important player, not Luke. If Ringrose had stayed outside instead of turning in then he might have been able to get back to the outside. By deciding to look inside to Luke's man he took himself out of the game and therefore it's play on for me because he was never getting there. I agree that Gibson initiated contact though so for me it's very very marginal and tbh the whole context of the game probably comes into play as well. If it was a tight game or a quarter final then I wouldn't be as comfortable with it being let go.
I thought we were great for the most part, it's really impressive that we were just as hungry as last week and put them away so early. I've come to accept that there are going to be some sloppy errors because of the way we want to play, but I wish we would be a little bit more conservative until we've put a score or two on the board.
Great to see Tadhg in full flow again. Treacy is actually playing very well, I think he's going under the radar a small bit just because Kelleher has been so good. Doris outstanding again and I'd certainly have him in the Irish squad now. It's hard to watch either himself or Deegan and not compare the two of them but they're both excellent in their own right really and if there's space then I'd actually have both of them in the 6N squad.
Ross Byrne is the most underrated player in the country IMO and I'd now pencil him in for a place in the Ireland 23 for the start of the 6N. Johnny and Joey may well be back soon but if we've learnt anything from 2019 it's that we need to trust players more and not have the mindset that we're goosed if certain players don't play.
Delighted for Dave Kearney. I'm one of those who wrote him off a while back (and also didn't think he was in good form before being selected for the game last week) but he's been excellent. Larmour sensational and he certainly looks like a proper fullback now. His footwork and eye for a gap are obviously amazing but his confidence under the high ball is great too.
